Eye On Horror
Eye On Horror
Belle Composer Matt Orenstein
This week, the boys get right to it to talk about The Last Voyage of the Demeter, Cobweb, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: Mutant Mayhem, Jay catches up on 2020 titles The Stylist and Don't Tell a Soul as well as DC Animated Movies, Jacob review TerrorVision's Some Guy Who Kills People Bluray and goes to his 2nd theatrical viewing of Dude Bro Party Massacre III, and Correia laughs at the notion of Joe Spinell's character in Maniac (1980) being an antihero. Spoiler alert, he is not.
The boys are then joined by composer Matt Orenstein to discuss his upcoming movie, Belle, a modern horror spin on the classic fairytale, Beauty and the Beast. We talk about his inspirations, his work process, what it was like to visit the cave locations in Iceland and more. Belle hits VOD tomorrow 8/22 and is playing in select theaters. It's all new on Eye On Horror!
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Welcome to Eye On Horror the official podcast of iHorror.com This is episode 111 Otherwise known as season six episode 12. I'm your host James Jay Edwards and with me as always is your other host Jacob Davison. How you doing Jacob?
Jacob Davidson:Fine.
James Jay Edwards:Well all right. Also with us as always is your other other host Jon Correia, how you doing Correia?
Jonathan Correia:Fine
Jacob Davidson:I just want it I just wanted to undercut it for once.
James Jay Edwards:Jacobs got places to go.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah. Let's make this quick.
James Jay Edwards:Let's jump right into it. The big release this week is the last voyage of the Demeter have we all seen it?
Jacob Davidson:I was at a spec- I was at a pre screening with the director André Øvredal and some of the producers in person. And you know, it's just wild to me, because I've been waiting for this movie for damn near 20 years. Like this shit was announced when I was in high school. Yeah, it's been a long journey.
Jonathan Correia:Which is interesting, because I did see someone asked him was this movie originally a part of the Dark Universe? Remember that? Remember when Universal tried launching
James Jay Edwards:Yeah, the Dark Universe
Jonathan Correia:And he was like, nah, this was with DreamWorks. And I was like, Yeah, I know that they were trying to do some Dracula shit. But like, I feel like this idea of doing an entire movie just about the Demeter, thats been in the works for ever.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:For if you if you're not familiar with the original Dracula book. The Last Voyage of the Demeter is based on one chapter in in the book of Dracula, and it's the Captain's Log chapter and it basically covers Dracula's voyage from Romania to London, and he he gets shipped there in a crate of dirt from his hometown, or from his home country. And in the book, the the ship runs aground with no crew, and a dog jumps off of it. And The Last Voyage of the Demeter is what happened on that voyage. What do you guys think?
Jacob Davidson:I really loved it. I enjoyed it. At the q&a, they even said originally, they had pitched it as Alien on a boat with Dracula. And I think it delivered on that premise because
James Jay Edwards:that's pretty much what it is. Yeah. When you imagine and you read the Captain's Log chapter of Dracula, what you imagine is like a slasher, which is basically what Alien is. But on a boat a slasher on a boat. And yeah, it does deliver on that. What about you, Correia?
Jonathan Correia:I loved it. I'm seeing that a lot of discourse, but I'm seeing a lot of people like there's the jokes of oh, it's Dracula on a boat how scary could it be? It's like, Dude, that's like, honestly, one of the most harrowing parts of the actual book. Like if you read that,
Jacob Davidson:oh, yeah,
Jonathan Correia:because it's all through Captain's log. And there's all these like, people are sick stuff
Jacob Davidson:found footage.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah,
James Jay Edwards:people just go missing. Yeah, he's like, he's all you know. We're having to do single watches because we don't have enough to double up Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:dude. It's terrifying and usually like in the movies because of budget and stuff. They not they allude to it or they like show like Dracula get packed up and then him arrive or something. Or in Coppola's Dracula, you know, there's that great, like montage-ish and where he's like, Wolfing out kind of like Monster so there's always like this allusion to it, but like it's never fully explored. So I was I was stoked about it. Yeah,
Jacob Davidson:it's funny you mentioned that because there is a slightly expanded upon version in the unofficial Dracula adaptation Nosferatu by FW Murnau which at the q&a Øvredal was even talking about that that was a major influence on them for the movie both in kind of the style and also the creature design for their version Dracula who is not like Francis Ford Coppola's Dracula or Gary Oldman Dracula. He's very he's very Max Schreck Dracula. Yeah,
James Jay Edwards:he's he's Murnau, he's he's, he's Nosferatu. Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:I was gonna say and even with that he's much more primal much more creature which is always like, one of the best parts of reasons why I like the Demeter part because this is just Dracula in pure predator mode. This isn't him like trying to like suave or trick people with words. This is him like alright, I am purely hunting these people but I I'm also keeping myself away. So no one's aware that it's me for as long as possible until it's too late.
James Jay Edwards:Here's the thing. I mean, I, I'm not as high on this movie as you two are. I loved the first half of it. You know, the whole like setup and then it but it gets to a point where, in my opinion, it kind of jumps the shark. And I kind of the second half. First of all, I don't think this needed to be a two hour movie. And the second half for me did drag. I love the first half. I also loved the vampire design, but my problem with the vampire it was played by Javier Botet who can do a lot cooler shit than he did in this movie. They didn't have the vampire do all that cool. Javier Botet shit, you know, he was I don't know, I, like I said, I think maybe I was expecting too much. But the second half of it kind of let me down a little bit. I was expecting Alien on a boat. And it pretty much was. But there's things you know, one thing I did like about it is, it is a little bit of a spoiler. But um, if you watch the trailer or anything, someone told me was in the trailer, don't think I've started watching trailers. There's a woman on the boat. And women on boats back then were considered bad luck. So it was like a bad omen. Well, she was there. Again, little bit of a spoiler. Fast forward a few seconds if you don't wanna hear. She's there for Dracula to feed on during the journey. And she kind of gets rescued. And so it's kind of a sympathetic version of Dracula because he didn't mean to kill all the people on this boat. But his food was taken away so he had to he had to, and that kind of falls in with the Universal Monsters to me the Universal Monsters are sympathetic characters with the exception of the Invisible Man, Invisible Man is just an asshole.
Jonathan Correia:Well....
James Jay Edwards:Nah the Invisible Man is that you can not defend the Invisible Man from being an asshole
Jonathan Correia:not the not the Invisible Man. Oh, that's one of the reasons why I love it. He's just a deliciously villainous character. And that's why he's my favorite. But I would disagree on the sympathetic part of Dracula. I feel like his food was taken away. And so it was kind of like, Oh, you took my food away? Well fuck you. You know, like,
James Jay Edwards:that is like there's a little bit of vengeance in there. Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:he was siphoning off of her and keeping her alive to take a little bit to go from that to just like, eating like a six man crew and all the animals on board like that. That's a bit overkill. That's a that's a bit of a that's a bit of a petty revenge, which I love a petty villain. So and I agree, I think
James Jay Edwards:it's nuclear revenge. What he did not petty. Yeah.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, I would say the movie does not really paint him in a sympathetic light in any sense. Especially because I mean, even if he was he just had that girl. Like, he was still draining life from this poor girl for an entire you know, voyage like that. So you know, fuck Dracula.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah, fuck Dracula. That's, that's, uh, you know, the thesis of all this. But I agree, I think it could have been like, 10-15 minutes shorter. You know,
James Jay Edwards:I think 40 minutes shorter. This could have been an 80 minute movie.
Jonathan Correia:Nah
James Jay Edwards:It's one chapter in the book!
Jacob Davidson:Although I think they did a pretty decent job expanding on it. But I do think they probably could have been shortened a little bit. Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:Another one of my issues is with the exception of the captain and the doctor. You don't really care about any of these characters. You know, you care about the little kid because he's a little kid. But you know, you don't even care about the girl that much. You know, um, so in there, I guess for a movie that long. I think they should have developed the characters more so you care about them? Besides the first mate, the captain, the doctor, you know, and the girl the other crew members. They were interchangeable. I didn't even know who was who, you know.
Jacob Davidson:Well, David Dastmalchian's character stood out.
James Jay Edwards:He was the first mate. Yeah, yeah, he was the first mate so you knew who he was? Yeah. Oh, he
Jonathan Correia:was awesome. As always, like, he was like, Anytime he's in something. He's like the standout. But
James Jay Edwards:there was a little bit of character there because this is the equivalent of the of the cop who's retiring in two days. This is the captain's last journey
Jacob Davidson:And it's Liam Cunningham from like, Dog Soldiers.
James Jay Edwards:Yeah. And he says at the beginning, he's like, this is gonna be my last voyage. And I'm recommending you to be captain. So it's like, yeah, the first mate is going to get the ship so he wants this journey to go well, and the captain wants this journey to go well, because he doesn't want his last journey to be this disaster. So
Jonathan Correia:And they want the bonus pay.
James Jay Edwards:The rest of the crew wants the bonus pay to Yes. So there are reasons why they didn't just pull into a port and say not kill that thing. You know?
Jonathan Correia:There was a lot of really good because you got to you got to work the logic like how was he able to hide us a lot before they realized how was Dracula able to get all these people and I think they did a really good job with the logistics of all that until there's one scene where someone is behind a door and a hole is broken through the door. It's kind of a Shining moment right? And then he kind of sticks his arm through but that does it but that doesn't open the door and then others come up and they're like banging on the door being like open the door open the door and I'm just sitting there Going put your arm through the hole Put your arm through the hole and no one's putting their arm through the hole and then someone tries to put their arm to the hole but they don't try hard enough and they're like oh I can't reach the door handle make the hole bigger make the hole bigger pull your arm to do that was my that's my one frustration with the movie is just sitting there going put your arm through the hole. But yeah, I still had a lot of fun with it. You know it's a it was a great take on it. I would watch a sequel to it to be honest, like The Devil of the Demeter or something like I want to see that Dracula unleashed on London
Jacob Davidson:It's funny at the q&a and Øvredal even mentioned that remember Dracula takes the boat back to Transylvania later on in the book. So
Jonathan Correia:how with how it landed?
James Jay Edwards:It was wrecked? Yeah.
Jacob Davidson:Well, no, he takes a different he takes a different boat because remember, he goes back to Transylvania at the end of the book
James Jay Edwards:in the book The the ship just kind of goes into port with no one on it. In the movie, it gets wreck
Jacob Davidson:out and I mean, like he it's a different boat like at the end he takes he takes another boat in order to get back to Transylvania because remember, loose air sorry. Jonathan and Van Helsing are chasing after him. He goes back Transylvania.
Jonathan Correia:But speaking of the cast of the Demeter the little the young boy in that movie was also an another horror movie that came out this summer Cobweb
Jacob Davidson:Oh, yeah, I saw that. Did you guys see Cobweb? Yeah, I just watched it a couple days ago. I rented it. Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:you know why? It's because they released it the same weekend as Barbie and Oppenheimer in like, the most limited amount like I'm in LA and there was three theaters playing it here. All like 11pm Showings, thats it. It was such a limited release. And what a travesty to do that because it was a fun movie. Like very atmospheric very, it's, I think, Jacob you and I talked about a little bit earlier and it's it's a Halloween movie. So like I released in the middle of July?
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, it's the same with the Haunted Mansion. Why would you release this in July? It's a Halloween movie.
James Jay Edwards:I don't get that about Haunted Mansion. I don't know why they they did it. It's a Halloween movie.
Jacob Davidson:It's ridiculous. Like they're both even set around Halloween for God's sake Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:it's weird but like Cobweb though at this movie I'd say go in as blind as possible so Jays whole thing about not watching trailers. Honestly like the trailer doesn't give away a whole lot which is which is good. But like there's there's enough of like, it's just going in blank. So there's a lot of weirdness going on. But Woody Norman is the child actor who was in Last of the Demeter, this, and he was also in C'mon Cmon with Joaquin Phoenix, so that kids blowing up right now. But it's also got Lizzie Kaplan and Anthony Star and I don't know if it's just because of Anthony Star's performance in the boys. But like, immediately, like seeing him in like pop up on the screen. It's like red flag. All right, that guy here to do some weird shit.
Jacob Davidson:That was a good casting choice in that regard. And also, it looked to be very practical effects oriented. Because again, not going into spoilers, but there is some pretty cool and creepy effects throughout the movie, and it is like genuinely very eerie type of movie because it kind of has this sort of Guillermo del Toro dark fantasy horror vibe to it. But, ya know, it's it's unfortunate that, you know, it was so limited and it's released in theaters. Because yeah, I mean, it's fine seeing it at home, but I do wish I had the chance to have seen it on a big screen.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah, so like, I mean, it's out on Blu Ray, what's on VOD right now for like seven bucks. It's well worth it. It's an on Blu ray in September, but I mean, I'm going to add it to my Halloween rotation. And I Yeah, I'd love to hear from Samuel Bodin on what happened with the release because it was announced in 2020 too that it was going to be made so it's been like worked on for three years and Samuel Bodin did the Marianne show for Netflix a few years back if you ever watched that horror series that was really good too. But yeah, Cobweb is awesome. You know, I'm gonna champion it I think that's this year's Empty Man where it's just like whoa, this is good. Why is this getting just kind of like, Bleh out there you know, like lions get I get it Lionsgate is trying to you know save room for Saw X in October so maybe that's why they're
Jacob Davidson:Horror fans got enough love for both,
Jonathan Correia:Yeah dude, like
James Jay Edwards:they didn't. They I don't think that hired any PR for Cobweb either, They did it themselves so?
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, no I mean like most of what I heard about it was either secondhand or for trailers. It was not very marketed.
James Jay Edwards:Yeah. Speaking of 2020 You like that segue? There's a couple of movies from 2020 that I caught up with that I'm not sure if you guys have seen the first is The Stylist either you guys see The Stylist?
Jacob Davidson:Oh I saw that!
James Jay Edwards:Yeah. Okay. This movie is pretty freakin awesome. It's kind of like Maniac but with a with a female antihero. I guess it's about it's about a hairstylist who is kind of it she's kind of like an American Psycho kind of killer. It's
Jonathan Correia:I've never heard of Maniac being the story of an antihero
Jacob Davidson:Joe Joe palot Err, sorry Joe Spinell. Yeah, it wasn't exactly what I would call an anti hero in that one
James Jay Edwards:it's actually more the the the girl in The Stylist is an antihero more than then Spinel. And she's played by i I'm gonna butcher this name Majora Townsend, who was also in Contracted. She's the one who who plays The Stylist, and she's more of an antihero, but not so much Spinel. But um, this movie, it's crazy. And Bria Grant plays a woman who's getting married and so she she asked the stylists to do her hair for the wedding. And the stylist is like, at first she's like, I don't do weddings. And you know, that puts up like a little flag in your you're like, Well, why doesn't she do weddings? It's Oh, it's it's so much fun. It's so much under slashers. And the other one that I caught up with this a little older. Don't Tell a Soul. Yeah, generic title, Have you seen it?
Jonathan Correia:That's the one with Rainn Wilson.
James Jay Edwards:Yeah, yes, yeah, it's real, total generic sounding title. But what it is, is these two teenagers go they break into a house, it's being termite tented and they steal a bunch of money, and they get chased away by security guard. And as they're running through the woods, the security guard falls into a well, that is a sealed off. Well, that is covered with leaves. And he's played by Rainn Wilson. So he's now at the bottom as well, and he can't get out. And one of the kids feels kind of guilty about this. But the other one is, is like well, now let him Let him frickin starve. Let them freeze. If
Jonathan Correia:he gets out, then we'll be in trouble. So we're fine. Like just Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:And the other kid starts like bringing in water and a blanket. And you know, and it's a really interesting and it goes somewhere that I did not expect it to. But yeah, it's another one of those little crazy movies that I just happen to catch up with.
Jonathan Correia:I think that was one of those ones, kind of similar to Cobweb, where I was like, Why is no one talking about this? Like, it's a solid, It's a solid little movie with like, some very good atmosphere. Very good. Like Rainn Wilson. His character is very interesting. And like, especially it has, like, develops and like the relationship between the with him and the kids. It's like, it's very, yeah, it's a solid little thrill. I think it's on like, Hulu or something. But
James Jay Edwards:it has it's a real generic name. So that too. Yeah. Don't Tell a Soul is kind of you know, it is, you know, I think what if they had I don't know what you would name it other than that. But if it had a different title that might have done, you know, gotten a little more attention at the time.
Jonathan Correia:It's no Hider in the House, you know?
Jacob Davidson:Yeah. You hear Hider in the House, you know what you're getting. Yeah. And conversely, on underscored movies, but oppositely this had a very interesting title. I revisited a movie that I was a big fan of in high school that got a Blu ray release from Terrorvision, called Some Guy Who Kills People by Jack Perez. Have you seen it?
Jonathan Correia:No. What's it about?
James Jay Edwards:Is it about a bear on cocaine?
Jacob Davidson:But no, no, it's okay. Yeah, it's some guy who kills people. That's the title. And it's, it's actually very interesting because it's about a, it's it's kind of a more grounded slasher, kind of mystery thriller. dark comedy video. So basically, it's about this guy that's been in a mental asylum for years because he was horribly traumatized in a beating by the local basketball team in this small town. And he was a former comic book artist, and he has to resort to working at an ice cream store. And when he comes back, he's like trying to rebuild his life, I guess to move back in with his mom was played by Karen Black and is verbally abusive to him and the people that beat him so badly end up having a mental breakdown, start getting killed off one by one, but it seems like it could be him, but there's like a lot more to it. And also, Barry Bostwick has a great role as the locals Sheriff investigating the murders. And yet it's it's it's very interesting because it goes does kind of take a closer look at kind of the revenge slasher killing type of plot but kind of puts it over its head and I it's really funny. It's got some great kills. And yeah, I was just one of those like indie independent horror comedies from like the 2010s came out 2011 That I feel like didn't get enough attention.
James Jay Edwards:I've never heard of it. I mean, at least, at least not that I remember. I mean, the guy who kills people is just
Jacob Davidson:Some Guy Who Kills People guy. Some Guy Who Kills People. That's it. That is one of my favorite horror movie titles, though.
Jonathan Correia:Did you guys see Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Mutant Mayhem?
Jacob Davidson:Yes. Yes. Yes, Jay? I loved that movie.
James Jay Edwards:I did not.
Jonathan Correia:You got to see it. It's
Jacob Davidson:Oh, yeah, you gotta see it.
Jonathan Correia:Good. It's, uh, it's the new TMNT movie. Right? This one, they go back and they really go back to the teenage aspect of it. Which
Jacob Davidson:Like they even have teenage actors play the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles for once
Jonathan Correia:These are actually like, 13-14 year old kids. Yeah. And they did. There's so much good.
James Jay Edwards:Is it claymation? Or is it
Jacob Davidson:No, no, it's actually CG animation, but it's kind of like that spider verse thing where like, they really stylize it. So yeah, looks like it's a week kind of a weird cel shaded claymation type of style. But it's also got this kind of ad like 80s comic book style, where like, the people are kind of weird looking. And like everything's kind of stylized.
Jonathan Correia:The animation is phenomenal. And yeah, and it's not just like the character design but the story and the vibe everything is it really does feel like the perfect blend of like the original Eastman and Lord comics that were black and white, very brutal. And the 90s cartoon which was very comical and vibrant.
Jacob Davidson:Oh, and also the anime influences of the 2003 version.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah, yeah, I thought this was like a great like, Alright, we're gonna take everything that's been done before and like reworking into our own voice and it was phenomenally done they made some few changes to the origin that I thought worked really well you know, and It's got Jackie Chan as Master Splinter Which was great so it's great. I mean, if you have an old mentor it's got to be Jack Chan but I'm also in part of the origin they kind of took away all the stuff about clans and how like you know their descendants in this clan and with the ninjas and like, you know, ultimately going to get Shredder instead it's a they lean more into now they were just these animals that were mutated and like they learned all their ninja skills through like YouTube videos of VHS tapes, so it's really goofy, the montage. You see Master Splinter with like a moustache and big hair and stuff, but and the soundtrack is like all 90s New York hip hop for the most part there's like some Old Dirty Bastard in there some De La Soul. They got Ante Up and of course they included the ninja Rap from Teenage Ninja Turtles 2.
James Jay Edwards:Go ninja Go ninja go.
Jonathan Correia:But that wasn't even the best needle drop the best needle drop. They have an entire chase sequence set to the internet version of heeeeeya, you know like the old he-man one from early internet? Oh,
Jacob Davidson:yeah. Nice
Jonathan Correia:it. Yeah. What's great is they work it in the chase starts and then like all of a sudden, it was the chameleon. I can't remember.
Jacob Davidson:Mondo Gecko play by Paul Rudd.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah, Mondo, Gecko who's like a surfer stoner character played by Paul Rudd. Great. He the song basically kicks off with him go. Hey, whats going on? It's so good
Jacob Davidson:I also like, I was really like this fight scene they have set to No Diggity. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, like they have four different fights, but integrate them into one. Fight animation set to no diggity. And it is incredibly animated. Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:I'm just so excited for like children to leave the theater and go I want to listen to the soundtrack and because like there's a playlist on Amazon, and the first song on is Ante up. And so I could just imagine just like a bunch of little kids leaving the theater go. Ante up, yap that fool. Ante up, kidnap that fool. It's the perfect time it, oh man, it's just that fills my heart with joy.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah. Also, I was at yet another revivals screening of Dude Bro Party Massacre III at Alamo Drafthouse, which makes it my second this year
Jonathan Correia:Of just that one movie?
Jacob Davidson:Yes.
Jonathan Correia:How many times have you seen it now?
Jacob Davidson:Eh probably like,
Jonathan Correia:Check your letterboxd
Jacob Davidson:Well, that's the thing. I saw it before I had letterboxd. So it's probably more like 10 or 12 times maybe
James Jay Edwards:is that more than Mandy, wasn't it Eight?
Jacob Davidson:You know, honestly, I can't I can't keep track that Uh, but you know, it's just such a fun movie to see with the crowd though. And also like all the five second films guys were there. And I even got a VHS copy of Dude Bro Party Massacre III that they just struck. So now I've got it on Blu ray and VHS as it was meant to be because you know, the whole shtick is that it's like in a VHS kind of style with
like, 4:3 and like, the crappy quality. And yeah, no, it's just still one of my favorite kind of crowd horror comedies as of recent is like, every time I see, you know, especially at Alamo, like, just big laughs from the audience. A lot of shocktastic, like the crazy shit. It's just such a fun movie.
Jonathan Correia:I could see that be going working well with a crowd. You know, there's some movies where it's like, yeah, that's pretty good. And then you see it a second time with like the crowd here, like, oh, wow, that's so much better than I thought it was, you know?
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, no, it definitely works better with a crowd. It's like, yeah, just that kind of effect.
Jonathan Correia:I'll go to the next one with you, hows that. If there's another one of these screenings. Apparently, there's multiple happening in a year.
Jacob Davidson:Oh yeah the last one was in January, so who knows? But either way, whenever it plays, I gotta be there.
James Jay Edwards:Going back to animation. I've been kind of I've been binging my there was a deal on on iTunes a few months back with the DC animated universe for a ridiculous price like eight bucks for like 20 movies. So
Jonathan Correia:You messaging me about the continuity with that, hahahaha
James Jay Edwards:Yeah, well, that's another thing but Correia gave me the order that I should watch these and so I started watching them like that. And I'll tell you, the funnest ones. So far, I'm about halfway through a little more than halfway through the list that you gave me. The funnest ones are the Teen Titans ones. I think they're like, you know, this isn't the Teen Titans. I remember from my youth with like Aqua lad and Kid Flash and speedy. These are like Blue Beetle is one of them. Raven, of course Robin is there but it's like different Robins. But my favorite is Beast Boy. My favorite thing that he does, he's fighting a demon he turns into a kangaroo. And he jumps up in the air and then turns into an elephant.
Jonathan Correia:And just plops on him
Jacob Davidson:That's one way to settle on that.
James Jay Edwards:So awesome. My second favorite thing that Beast Boy does is turn into a goat it just start ramming people. Yeah.
Jonathan Correia:You gotta love the randomness of Beast Boy. And like, you gotta have a little bit of camp with that, because he just turns into animals, you know?
James Jay Edwards:But it was it was funny, because like Correia said, I messaged you about about the continuity. All of a sudden, it's like, I got to Justice League Dark, and all of a sudden Hawkman is there. And it's not how Jordan it's Jon Stewart as the Green Lantern. I'm like, oh, did I miss a movie or something? He's like, Oh, no.
Jonathan Correia:Continuity isn't the the best, but there's still a lot of fun. And those, those animated ones are based off of like the New 52 When they rebooted DC, like two or three reboots ago. So the lineups are and character design. And especially when you get to like the death and Death of Superman and Reign of Superman. It's more based off of that, which is good. It's much better than the first animated Death of Superman. Superman Doomsday. But yeah, if honestly, if you really liked the Teen Titan movies, and in that series when you're done going through the movies, check out Young Justice. That's a it's an animated show that they did the first season is a lot more kid friendly. But it gets darker with each season and more adult and like the themes and things that they cover because it's not exactly Teen Titans. It's basically the Young Justice group is all the sidekicks get together and they kind of become the Justice League's like secret psyops group so like they're the ones that go on the unofficial missions and stuff and especially like second season on they get real real dark with like, what that meanss and what that what comes with that you know, and they incorporate a lot of cool stuff they have a I think it was third season they incorporate the Batman Incorporated plot where Batman is basically like fuck the Justice League I'm starting my own you know thing and it's just all the bat family and it's got Batman Inc because of course you know he asked to write off the taxes on it that's what billionaires do they find some bullshit reason to not pay taxes
James Jay Edwards:Bruce Wayne and his loopholes
Jonathan Correia:You know that fucker ain't paying taxes!
Jacob Davidson:Oh, no, he ain't in fact in. It's funny in that this is a spoiler for the Harley Quinn animated series, but okay, spoiler alert for season three. Basically, Bruce Wayne gets arrested for tax evasion because he was allocating so much of his money into Batman stuff.
Jonathan Correia:Didn't Harley call him out too when like when she found out he was Batman. Couldn't you have put this money into public programs and health care? And he's just like, gets it I get Batman to total him himbo in that right.
Jacob Davidson:Kinda, I mean, he's still Batman and pretty effective. But you know, they do kind of poke fun at him.
Jonathan Correia:Man, I they dropped the fourth season of Harley Quinn on max with like, no fanfare at all.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, I saw some ads for it. But it was and I hope more people are watching it too, because like this shows just been getting better and better. And this new season is really good where Harley Quinn actually joins the bat family and poison ivy is in charge of the Legion of Doom. And shenanigans ensue.
Jonathan Correia:Yeah, the Valentine's Day special was
Jacob Davidson:oh, man, that was that was something silly. Yeah, I still love James adamian. As Bane. Yeah, that's Lindsey's favorite part. of course,
Jonathan Correia:like the only animated show I've been able to get her into.
James Jay Edwards:And now let's bring in this episode's guest. We've got Matt Orenstein, the composer of the upcoming movie, Belle, how you doing, Matt?
Matt Orenstein:I'm doing great. Jay. Great to be here.
James Jay Edwards:Thanks for joining us this morning. The question I like to start with, with everybody is how did you get started? In your in your composing career?
Matt Orenstein:How did I get started, um, I've been I've been playing music since I was four. I started violin, I hated it. One day, I said to my teacher, this will be my last lesson. And so it was I think I was also a four when that happened. I took piano but you know, from the time I was six to the time I was 13, picked up the bass somewhere in there and from there on, and I've been smitten with the bass went to school as a bass player. My in with music is being a bass player. You know, in orchestra rehearsals, I would always pay extra attention when we would stop the orchestra and listen to what when the when the conductor When you say bass you're talking to orchestral bass though now. would rehearse the different sections. I would try and pay attention to think okay, how is this put together? Because I've always been fascinated by I've always been listening to music as far as movie scores. When I saw The Sixth Sense, it kept me up for two weeks. Not particularly because the visuals those were pretty crazy to a 12 year old or however old I was think it was 10, it was the music that did it. I remember that sort of buzzing score whenever whenever the main character whenever Cole would see a dead whenever Cole would see dead people. And then the feeling of that jumpscare and that never really left me. And I guess I'd sort of been chasing that for most of my life. When I got to college. I I went in as a performance major. But I realized I wanted to do a little something a little different. So I I talked to the I talked to the Conservatory where I went. And they allowed me to score they allowed me to do a score for the Cabinet of Dr. Caligari as my final project. So I scored that. And then when I moved to Chicago, I was working as a theater composer, record store clerk, music teacher, moonlighting as a bass player. And then I got a couple of film gigs that I really liked. And my work in theater with theater companies with dance companies. The more I did it, the more I realized I really liked composing for for something that you can see. And I had to move out to LA. So I moved out here in 2016. And within a year I was I reconnected with my old friend Max Gold, who is the director of Belle and he and I have been working together ever since. Yeah, punk rock bass guitar. Okay. I mean, I started as a punk rock bass guitarist, I love it. Yeah, but yeah, I'm trained as an I'm trained as a as an upright bass player in classical and jazz. Yeah,
Jonathan Correia:Get one that can do both, you know, both the classical upstanding bass and the punk rock.
Matt Orenstein:Oh, yeah. Fun.
Jacob Davidson:And what was your first project with Max? Or how did he first approach you on it?
Matt Orenstein:We, we work together on his first feature called Silicon Beach. We, you know, we reconnected when I moved here. We had sort of, you know, we kept track of each other, but hadn't really talked as much in the years between high school and us moving out here. But we reconnected and he showed me a script, and the next thing you know, I'm working on this feature that he's making and it was awesome. It was so fun. Yeah. Not really much of a story there. We just, you know, kind of reconnected at the right time and started working together.
James Jay Edwards:Let's talk a little bit about Belle. Yes, the score for Belle. What is your process? Like? It sounds to me like it's like, like most of its synthesized. Is it actually a synthesizer or did you use an orchestra for it?
Matt Orenstein:No orchestra also. That's an analog synth. That's
James Jay Edwards:even now the violin parts were those synthesizer. Did you play those because you started with the violin? No,
Matt Orenstein:I didn't play the violin parts. There's a viola solo in the middle of the movie that my friend my friend Yvette played. And I played a lot of the upright bass parts, some of which you can't really tell are upright bass parts. There's some weird upright bass techniques that I'm using to sort of sweeten the score a little bit. And then on the suete at the very end, during the end credits, Max's dad plays the Jazz Bass Solo. Max's dad was one of my first teachers. And he's, he's great. Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:So what is your process? Like when, when you're from script to final score? How do you compose? How
Matt Orenstein:Yeah. I read the script. I get some initial do you do it? impressions. And I talked to the director. And then the big thing about my process for this one was I actually went to Iceland, because when I was talking to Max, he said, If you really want to do this movie, there's a feeling that Iceland has the I'm trying to convey, and you can't, you can't convey it unless you've got it in your bones. So I don't care if you I don't care if you like get off the plane and then get right back on as long as you just like, and, you know, breathe in the air. I want you to have that feeling. So I went to Iceland my process was I walked around with an iPhone, like, recording wind sounds because apparently there wasn't, you know, I talked to the sound recordist and I said I'd like to record some nature sounds incorporated into the score. And he just said, you know, it's mostly wind out here. So, I, I, I went through a couple of shoot days where my directive was mostly to stay hidden and explore and so I did I, you know, when we were in the cave, where we're Belle and Beast, where, you know, there's some action that happens with there's some stuff that happens with Belle and Beast, where beast lives. And so it's where she's for a bit. I went to that cave. The cave was like, built into the side of a mountain. So I walked up that mountain, and the sun was out at 10pm was crazy. I walked there was like a, what looked like an undisturbed druid prayer circle. It was these very unnaturally flat stones at the top was crazy. But just like seeing stuff like that it wasn't an ethno musicological mission by a longshot. It was just, I wanted to go to Iceland. I wanted to see what it felt like. And I wanted to convey that through score. And then once I did that, I didn't write a note until I got footage. You know, and after I talked temp with Max and our editor, Patrick, you know, then, you know, took us a few drafts of the score to really get it. But at the end, we really dialed it down.
Jonathan Correia:And it was very successful in capturing that I It wasn't until I did looking into it after the movie that I realized, oh, this was an American production that shot in Iceland. It really felt like that that feeling of authenticity. There we go of the Yeah, movies
James Jay Edwards:that shoot in Iceland always look to me almost like tourism advertisements for Iceland, because it's such a beautiful country like, like glam or Boca or
Jacob Davidson:Oh yeah that Viking boat tour? Viking boat tours. Yeah, remember that?
Jonathan Correia:Valhalla Rising?
Jacob Davidson:There was like an infomercial that was floating around for a while.
James Jay Edwards:Oh, I thought you're talking about a movie about a Viking boat tour
Jacob Davidson:no, I was talking about like, there was an actual infomercial for like Viking cruise boat tours around Iceland and Norway.
Jonathan Correia:I don't know why I thought Viking boat tour. Yeah, Valhalla Rising. That's that's definitely the plot of that movie.
Matt Orenstein:I love that. Movie is great. It's so the all of that. It kind of feeds into figured.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah. And, and on the subject. How did Max pitch you on the idea of, of this version of Beauty and Beast.
Matt Orenstein:Max had been working on some version of this movie for a very long time. And so I knew it was in the pipeline. For him, I knew it was something he really, really, really wanted to do, even as we worked on Silicon Beach. And then there was a pilot. There's a project called Surfers Paradise that we worked on together. Some more sci fi, but I always knew that I think we both knew that beast was, that Belle was something that that was, that was a big dream. That was something that he really wanted. And I didn't think I thought he was going to go with an Icelandic composer. So I read a bunch of drafts of the scripts and I weighed in, as you know, a friend and collaborator, and then one day I was like, so who are you getting in Iceland? Who do you have your eye on? And he was like, well I was thinking you would do it? So that was the pitch just like you would do it? And then when you know, when Max says that I say okay, I'm doing it Yeah,
James Jay Edwards:going back to what you're saying about incorporating the wind or the natural sound into the score. I noticed some of that in the score. And I was wondering if that was sound design or score, because it's the whole score was kind of ethereal. You know, it's, and, and there were times and I was like, Okay, wait, is that sound effect? Or is that part of this? Because there is like a pitch to it, there's a note to it. But it's almost like this ambient buzz more than it is an actual van. So was that the point of that, you know, of incorporating the, the natural sounds into it, just to kind of make it almost almost sound design instead of score?
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, I mean, I think ideally, they sort of meld. You know, it's, it's all it's all of a piece score, picture. Sound design, like, the score is just a part of, it's just a piece of the puzzle. Every synth patch I had, I would, you know, throw a little bit of noise on there, every string, every string patch, I would design or every sample instrument, I would try to, if there was a way to make it sound like there was just a little bit more bow hair, I would do that. When I would play my bass parts, whether it was the artificial harmonic drones that you hear throughout the score, or the bass solos, I would loosen the bow hair, when I bowed, and the effect that that has, is you hear that kind of grit. It sounds more like a viola da gamba, or something like that, which is a, you know, an early, you know, an earlier Baroque instrument, where you control the at least the Basecamp, I don't know about the viola, you control the tension of the bow with your hand. And the roughness as a roughness, the sort of layer of white noise above it is a kind of dynamic in and of itself.
James Jay Edwards:Most people know Beauty and the Beast, obviously from the Disney musical. Was there pressure to how do I say this? The music from that is so well known? Did you consciously step away? It's a very different movie. So you may not have had to do this. But did you consciously step away from that, you know, to, to make sure that it sounded completely different. Or it was just because the movie called for something completely different
Matt Orenstein:The movie called for something completely different. So I didn't have to step. I didn't really have to step anywhere that anywhere that I wasn't being kind of direct anywhere that A I wasn't being directed to go and B that I didn't think I needed to go. I mean, we were all on the same page, I think. Yeah, I think I don't know if the Disney version came up. I mean, it's just sort of one of those things like we've all seen it. We all lived it. We all know Be Our Guest.
Jonathan Correia:We're not doing that.
Matt Orenstein:We're not doing that. Okay, talk more. Talk more about La Belle et la Bête. The Cocteau version?
Jonathan Correia:That's what I was gonna ask.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, yeah, we're huge fans of that. I've only seen it the one time I saw it in high school. My dad and my uncle went have these on that old Janus box set of 50 movies. You remember that? Oh, yeah. And so we just had that in the house when I was a senior in high school. And when I would come home from college, and I just popped that in one day. And I was like, Well, this is this is freaky. I like this. Yeah, Max and I are both Bergman fans. So that was more I mean, the tone of that was the tone of his stuff was something that he and I talked about. And I don't know if it really made it into. I don't know how much of an influence it was directly on Belle. But it was something that it was a common ground for both of us. So something that at least I was thinking about a little bit.
James Jay Edwards:This is definitely not the Disney Beauty and the Beast.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
Jonathan Correia:One of the things I really liked about Belle is that it it doesn't like flip flop between genres, but it's not afraid to one moment go into like a horror and then the next kind of be more of a romance. And then there's even like, some comedic was, was, was that a fun challenge? To be bouncing around between those moods and settings and kind of feels with that while also keeping the consistency of the of the piece?
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, I guess so. I mean, I didn't really, I wasn't really thinking too hard about it. When I when I when I was writing the score, I think I was really what I really wanted to do was have a kind of musical language that could accommodate both, you know, I mean, because actors, actors can do both actors can do great actors can do anything. And oftentimes, you know, in a lot of movies, you'll see them kind of go go back and forth and be a little more dynamic. So once we sort of figured out once we sort of figured out what could what what tonal what instruments what genres what, what musical conventions could have room for both romance and, and and horror, and that horror, horror comedy is not much of a stretch
Jonathan Correia:The it's the same setup just different punch line.
James Jay Edwards:Yeah, we discussed that a lot.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah. Have you seen? I mean, just as an aside, have you seen the recut trailer to The Shining as a comedy? Oh, yeah. Yeah. A horror Mrs. Doubtfire? Yeah. Yeah. We wanted something that was that was pretty limber and could move between romance or romance and horror on a dime. I think a lot of room I think there's emotionally there's a lot of carryover too. I mean, just look at Wuthering Heights, you know. I mean, that goes from romance to straight up like grave robbing very, you know, in the matter of pages.
James Jay Edwards:So, or something like Bones and All
Matt Orenstein:right. Oh, god, that was that was that was a crazy movie. Yeah, I Yeah. Wow.
Jonathan Correia:Especially for Jay. He didn't know anything going into that. So yeah.
James Jay Edwards:Well, I do I purposely avoid any kind of trailers or anything. So that first scene, I was just like, Oh my God. This movie?
Matt Orenstein:Yeah. You could almost see the you could almost see the smell rising.
James Jay Edwards:Oh, yeah.
Jonathan Correia:That's a horrible way to describe, but very accurate
Jacob Davidson:No, worse way would be finger licking good. Which I took from Shocker with Horace pinker. Remember he did that did?
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, that's
Jonathan Correia:Wes really tried to create another Freddy with Shocker didn't he?
Jacob Davidson:Yep. Can you imagine seven Shocker movies?
Jonathan Correia:I kind of wish that did happen to be honest.
Jacob Davidson:Don't we all? Back at it with Belle, How did you approach the music when it came to the characters.
Matt Orenstein:So Papa was I kind of when I work on a score, this is probably you know, something that is true to my process. A lot of the times I'll sort of start where out wherever I can get a foothold. And in this case, I was chipping away at the edges. Before I really got into Belles theme before that was the last thing that compose. The first character that I composed for was Papa, Papa I felt was pretty easy to was pretty clear cut. He's very traditional, you know, an old you know, an aging war. You know, an aging. An aging man has his kind of ideas about what his daughter should be what he should be there as daughter. I felt like a sort of regal traditionally regal sounding, sounding proud sounding soundscape was what he deserved. Beast, beast I went about I just the theme just sort of came out. I was making a bunch of kinds of beastial sounds with all the string patches, you know, all the sample instruments and synthesizers. And then I just played this. I just played this kind of this, this melody on the prophet, which is a pretty cool synth. And it sounded, you know, I hung out with I hung out with Andy on the way to the cave, he drove me. So we spent a couple hours in the car together. We got to know each other a little bit. And I feel like that kind of I played that theme. And immediately Max was like that. That's it that that's beast. It's this melancholy sort of regal theme. Again, Regal because beast is a, you know, a prince. Yeah. Who gets cursed and falls very far. So I felt like I think we both felt like the theme adequately captured that Belle was a struggle, because rebel was a challenge, I should say. We tried a bunch of stuff. And, you know, what we settled on was something that was kind of like a lullaby. I guess, sort of, it happens in her private moments when you hear the voice of her and you hear the voice of her mother. And then finally the theme crystallizes. And I feel like the way that the way that we treat it sort of sums up Belle's journey. It's one of I don't want to get too much into what her journey is. But I feel like I feel like the theme tracks her progress the times that it appears. But we you know, we listened to a bunch of I listened to a bunch of stuff. I mean, I was listening a lot to the Bulgarian women's choir. I was listening to that Bjork record Medulla, which is awesome. You know that one?
Jonathan Correia:It's so good. Yeah,
Matt Orenstein:It's one of my favorites. One of my favorites, but just a lot of choral music, a lot of you know a few you know, Icelandic melodies here and there. And that's what came out at the very end. I think we god I don't remember it was very, very close to the finish line. It was wasn't quite at the one yard line, but it wasn't that far off. And then which, you know, the the witches soundscape is more feral. But it's it's, it's still, you know, it's still sensual, still alluring, because the witch has this sort of animal magnetism to her this pole But there's a wildness and I wanted to I wanted to convey that. So a lot of handled sophomore instruments a lot of weird percussion is sort of off kilter vocals, you know? Yeah. Alright, that's too granular.
Jonathan Correia:Never too granular. We love getting into the nitty gritty, especially the inspiration. So like, yeah, love a good Bjork reference.
Jacob Davidson:Can't have too much Bjork.
Matt Orenstein:She's all her influence is all over the score.
Jonathan Correia:That's awesome. I still say that she wasn't casted in the Northman. She just showed up one day, they were like, Yeah, go ahead. Like
James Jay Edwards:Robert Eggers is just like, hey,
Jonathan Correia:oh, yeah. Cool. We've been needing this part filled. And you're ready and costume costume? You're right. You're right. Yeah.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, she's one of my heroes. I love her.
Jonathan Correia:I especially like interviews, like the famous one where she's talking about her TV and like going through like the circuits and stuff. It's just like, it's so so it's genius. It's just I love when artists talk about like the intricacies of just like, the simple everyday life out items. Her and David Byrne are really good at that.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah. Yeah.
Jonathan Correia:And so, Belle comes out. Actually, tomorrow. Well, when this episode comes out on the 22nd, which is tomorrow on VOD, but you have another project that's coming out soon as well.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, I scored a movie very different movie called Daddy, that's going to be at Cinequest. It's going to be at the hammer theater in downtown San Jose as part of Cinequest. Very different movie. But I am proud of this one as well. Yeah. And then other than that, you know, I'm just mixing artists records and producing artists records and playing on other people's records. And there's a couple of films, you know, couple, you know, there's one or two film things in the pipeline, but not much happening right now. So
James Jay Edwards:whose records are you playing on?
Matt Orenstein:I'm mixing, I'm producing my friend Sarah do you do a lot of session work? And is it? Is it the bass that Nelson's record. And she's done some cool stuff. And we're working on something really cool right now. But yeah, I mean, other than that, just people around LA, you play? Or what Bass part play
James Jay Edwards:Okay, I do a lot of session work around there
Matt Orenstein:Trying to do more. Yeah, always trying to do more. I mean, composing is the first love for sure, but are composing is the main thing. But I love playing bass. And I love I mean, being a bass player is not much different than being a film composer, you show up you you're a part of a you're a part of a team. You try to make the project better and not outsize. Whatever it is you're doing. And like a good bass player, if you're missing a good film score, you really miss it.
James Jay Edwards:It's one of those things that you don't notice it's not there until it's not there. It's like you may not notice it when it is there. But when it's gone, you're like I remember hearing about test screenings of Halloween. Without the score. People thought it was a comedy. And then you add the score. And you're like, holy crap, this is terrifying. Yeah.
Jacob Davidson:Yeah, those make all the difference.
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, yeah.
Jonathan Correia:That's completely understandable. I'm giving notes right now and a documentary piece supposed to cut 20 minutes and I'm sitting there and there's no score. And I'm like, everything feels so boring. It's just talking heads. There's no action. All right, that's just got to remember the music will be added later. It'll be more interesting with music. Just focus on what's being said. Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:Thanks for joining us here today. Matt. Is there anything else you got coming up that that you can talk about? Or just have you we already covered what you got
Matt Orenstein:You covered what I've got covered. coming up?
James Jay Edwards:Yeah. Where can people find you on the socials to to kind of keep up with what you've got coming up as it comes up?
Matt Orenstein:My website is Mattornstein.com. Twitter is@Matt0renstein. But the O is zero. And Instagram, Matt_Orenstein.
James Jay Edwards:Did somebody have Matt Orenstein with a regular Oh or did you do that? Just on purpose?
Matt Orenstein:Yeah, no, there's another there are many Matt Orenstein There's like a hockey player and all hockey player from Hofstra. I think there's another Matt Orenstein in Hollywood. Who does something slightly who does something different than I do? Yeah, there's, it's, you know, there's definitely Matt Orenstein around.
James Jay Edwards:There's a Jay Edwards who worked on Adult Swim I think it is. So there are other people with your names, unfortunately. Yeah.
Matt Orenstein:Well, there's I follow the Minnesota Timberwolves, the basketball team that's been sort of woefully mismanaged as long as I've been you know, as long as they've been in existence and the the beat writer for I think the athletic for the wolves is John Krasinski. So, that's confusing,
Jonathan Correia:but not that John Krasinski not
Matt Orenstein:not yet not not Jim. Yeah.
James Jay Edwards:Well, thanks for joining us this morning, everybody. Go see Belle on, go see Belle. I mean, see Belle it's VOD. Starting tomorrow. If you listen to this today, it's released, hopefully all VOD platforms. You know, I'm sure you'll be able to find it somewhere, too if you want to find us Eye On Horror, we're on all the socials at @EyeOnHorror. Or you can go to iHorror.com which is the site we all call home. Our theme song is by Restless Spirit. So go give them a listen. Hey, Restless Spirit is coming to the West Coast. That is exciting. They're coming to LA. It's a Tuesday. I'm hoping I can come up for it.
Jonathan Correia:You're going to come up to LA for it?
James Jay Edwards:I'm gonna try shit. But I mean, it's a Tuesday, which is traditionally a pretty light Workday for me. So it might be looking good. Our artwork is by Chris Fisher. So give him a like, and we will see you again in a couple of weeks. So for me, James Jay Edwards.
Jacob Davidson:I'm Jacob Davison.
Jonathan Correia:I'm Jonathan Correia.
Matt Orenstein:I'm Matt Orenstein.
James Jay Edwards:Keep your Eye On Horror.
